Matt Connarton Unleashed: Oasis reunion tour problems get worse

0:00 Speaker 1: For the first hour, we have some music news, music

0:03 Speaker 1: industry news to discuss.

0:05 Speaker 2: You know, I love this stuff.

0:06 Speaker 1: I'm a music industry nerd and I do some things

0:10 Speaker 1: in the industry, and I have for a long time.

0:12 Speaker 1: But we were talking last week. I think it was

0:16 Speaker 1: last week. Was it last week or the week before?

0:19 Speaker 1: I have to be honest with you, It all blurs together, but.

0:22 Speaker 2: No, I think it was last week.

0:23 Speaker 1: We were talking about Oasis and this debacle. We have

0:29 Speaker 1: an update on this well, and it relates to another

0:32 Speaker 1: issue happening in the music industry.

0:33 Speaker 3: But so.

0:38 Speaker 1: Oasis tickets went on sale. It's the first time they're

0:41 Speaker 1: touring in fifteen years. The Gallagher brothers loll. I'm sorry,

0:45 Speaker 1: not loll Noel and Liam. I do that once in

0:48 Speaker 1: a while. I create amalgams of words. I combined Nol

0:55 Speaker 1: and Liam into loll. I'll just call them loll. So

0:58 Speaker 1: Lowell actually managed to stop arguing enough to say, let's

1:02 Speaker 1: go make some money. That's how the uh, that's how

1:06 Speaker 1: people who are cynical about it or talking about it right, Oh,

1:08 Speaker 1: this is just a money grab.

1:09 Speaker 2: Oasis is there. They're coming for our cash.

1:12 Speaker 1: They just want to make some money now, that's not

1:15 Speaker 1: how I think about it necessarily. I mean, again, I

1:20 Speaker 1: do understand that that's very often a purpose of doing this,

1:25 Speaker 1: but but I also am a fan of Oasis. Although

1:30 Speaker 1: it's funny so back in the day, back in the

1:32 Speaker 1: nineties when Wonderwall was on the radio every five minutes,

1:35 Speaker 1: I actually really liked it that Wonderwall. I thought was

1:38 Speaker 1: such a great song. And I still think it's a

1:40 Speaker 1: great song. But if I hear it now, I'm like, eh,

1:43 Speaker 1: I'm over it. Oh, I was over it a long

1:45 Speaker 1: time ago. Acquiesce is my favorite Oasis song, which was

1:49 Speaker 1: actually a B side. But anyway, I'm I think it's cool.

1:55 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not gonna go spend gobs of money.

1:58 Speaker 1: I don't know if they've even put any US tour

2:00 Speaker 1: dates on sale. I know they've got a bunch of

2:02 Speaker 1: UK dates, but you know, I'm not gonna go see

2:05 Speaker 1: them because I don't want to pay all that money

2:08 Speaker 1: and it's going to be expensive. It already is expensive

2:12 Speaker 1: because tickets went on sale in the UK, and that's

2:14 Speaker 1: what set off this whole controversy around the ticket sales themselves.

2:19 Speaker 1: But anyway, so Oasis, no matter how you feel about them,

2:22 Speaker 1: love them, hate them. They're kind of polarizing. I've always

2:24 Speaker 1: been a fan, but I also understand, and again, as

2:28 Speaker 1: someone who's done things in the industry, I have kind

2:33 Speaker 1: of a you know, I can look at it both

2:39 Speaker 1: as a fan and as a business. I can see

2:42 Speaker 1: it from both perspectives. So, yeah, maybe it is a

2:47 Speaker 1: money grab. I don't, you know, but it's a business.

2:49 Speaker 1: You got to make money, right, you got to make

2:50 Speaker 1: a living. You know, these guys probably.

2:52 Speaker 2: Spend a lot.

2:54 Speaker 1: They just seems, well, at least Liam does, probably spend

2:58 Speaker 1: a lot. Noel always struck me as a down to

3:00 Speaker 1: earth of the two, but I'm sure Liam has quite

3:04 Speaker 1: the lifestyle anyway.

3:06 Speaker 2: But put all that aside, regardless of how you feel

3:08 Speaker 2: about it.

3:08 Speaker 1: So we were talking on the show last week about

3:12 Speaker 1: tickets went on sale and the websites were crashing. I

3:17 Speaker 1: say websites plural because obviously you know Ticketmaster, which is

3:21 Speaker 1: owned by Live Nation. They put the tickets on sale,

3:24 Speaker 1: nobody could get them because the site kept crashing, but

3:27 Speaker 1: also the secondary sites were crashing, and then Oasis's management

3:31 Speaker 1: put out a statement saying, actually, don't even buy these

3:34 Speaker 1: tickets on secondary sites because those will be canceled. Those

3:38 Speaker 1: are not authorized. And we got into this a little

3:41 Speaker 1: bit last week Jenny and I talking about how, you know,

3:45 Speaker 1: you've got what a big tour like this goes on sale,

3:49 Speaker 1: So you've got Ticketmaster, which sells the tickets, but very

3:52 Speaker 1: often what happens is for I think a lot of

3:56 Speaker 1: people are probably pretty savvy to this already. But the

3:59 Speaker 1: reason that something can go on sale and then it

4:06 Speaker 1: sells out like immediately, I'm sure people probably assume, well,

4:12 Speaker 1: that's because of the Internet. You know that that didn't

4:15 Speaker 1: happen pre Internet for those of us who are old

4:18 Speaker 1: enough to remember, you know, when you would have to

4:20 Speaker 1: actually go and stand in line somewhere to buy tickets.

4:23 Speaker 1: But you know, things would sell out quickly, which is

4:25 Speaker 1: why if it was a big tour that you really

4:27 Speaker 1: wanted to see, you'd have to go and stand in line,

4:30 Speaker 1: you know, Like Jenny has told stories about, you know her,

4:33 Speaker 1: I think her and her mom standing in line for

4:35 Speaker 1: Prince tickets and like camping out overnight or something, or

4:37 Speaker 1: being there for hours.

4:39 Speaker 2: When Prince was touring.

4:42 Speaker 1: But then so the Internet comes along, for lack of

4:46 Speaker 1: a better way of putting it, and everything's available online.

4:50 Speaker 1: So things sell out instantly, and yes, uh, because in theory,

4:58 Speaker 1: you know, thousand, tens, hundreds of thousands, potentially millions of

5:03 Speaker 1: people can go and try to buy these tickets immediately

5:07 Speaker 1: once they go online in the digital age, so to speak.

5:10 Speaker 1: But there's another element to that. Very often these tickets

5:15 Speaker 1: are bought up by scalpers. And I don't mean when

5:19 Speaker 1: I say scalper, I don't mean the guy standing out

5:22 Speaker 1: in front of the venue trying to sell you a

5:23 Speaker 1: ticket to a sold out show because the show has

5:27 Speaker 1: sold out, but this random guy has tickets that he's

5:29 Speaker 1: willing to sell you at a premium cash only. I

5:34 Speaker 1: mean scalpers, these services, these ticketing sites that buy in

5:38 Speaker 1: bulk these tickets and then resell them at a profit.

5:45 Speaker 1: That goes on all the time. There are those who

5:51 Speaker 1: have tried to push back on it, trying to find

5:57 Speaker 1: ways to prevent that from happening, but it still goes on.

6:01 Speaker 1: And then, of course you've also got the other element

6:03 Speaker 1: of Ticketmaster itself. Some people think that, for example, the

6:08 Speaker 1: Live Nation Ticketmaster merger never should have been approved by

6:11 Speaker 1: the government. That gets into a whole other thing. So

6:14 Speaker 1: you know, a lot of people are dissatisfied with Ticketmaster

6:17 Speaker 1: itself as an entity. Remember back in the day again,

6:21 Speaker 1: this was yeah, this must have been in the nineties

6:23 Speaker 1: or early two thousands when Pearl Jam was kind of

6:26 Speaker 1: the first to say, hey, we don't even want to

6:28 Speaker 1: deal with Ticketmaster anymore. We don't like the way they

6:30 Speaker 1: do business, we don't like the way the fans are

6:32 Speaker 1: kind of getting the shaft. And so they started working

6:36 Speaker 1: with smaller you know, in various markets around the country.

6:39 Speaker 1: They started working with these smaller market ticketing agencies, which

6:43 Speaker 1: didn't really work out that great, and in the end

6:45 Speaker 1: pearl Jam had to give in, had to capitulate and

6:48 Speaker 1: go back to working with Ticketmaster.

6:49 Speaker 2: It's just the reality of it.

6:54 Speaker 1: So you've got all of that, and then you've got

6:58 Speaker 1: this new element. And this we did not talk about

7:01 Speaker 1: last week, but again it is part of this whole

7:04 Speaker 1: story with Oasis and these tickets. Is the dynamic pricing. Now,

7:11 Speaker 1: for those of you who don't know, you may have

7:14 Speaker 1: heard the term, some of you will know, some of

7:16 Speaker 1: you will not know what this is. But dynamic pricing

7:20 Speaker 1: is this concept where, well, you know, basic free market economics, right,

7:26 Speaker 1: supply and demand, When supplies low demand is high, things

7:31 Speaker 1: cost more money. Well, this concept has been applied to

7:36 Speaker 1: tickets and Ticketmaster uses it where Okay, so if demand

7:40 Speaker 1: is high for a show and supply is low, only

7:46 Speaker 1: so many tickets available, those tickets will automatically increase in price.

7:50 Speaker 2: There's even been who was it. There was a.

7:54 Speaker 1: Fast food restaurant chain that tried to do this, and

7:57 Speaker 1: I want to say it was Wendy's. They either tried

8:01 Speaker 1: it in some of their locations or they were testing

8:06 Speaker 1: it in maybe one location and they were thinking about

8:08 Speaker 1: rolling it out nationally or something. I don't remember all

8:10 Speaker 1: the details, but they tried to do some sort of

8:15 Speaker 1: dynamic pricing concept where at busy times of day the

8:18 Speaker 1: food would cost more. But I think they probably pulled

8:22 Speaker 1: the plug on that pretty quickly. I think it was

8:24 Speaker 1: Wendy's who tried to do this. But anyway, so this

8:27 Speaker 1: has been done with Ticketmaster, and that factors into the

8:31 Speaker 1: Oasis debacle, as it were, because now Ticketmaster is being

8:35 Speaker 1: investigated about the dynamic pricing. Now, if you're a ticket buyer,

8:43 Speaker 1: you may not like this very much. You might long

8:47 Speaker 1: for the days when tickets would go on sale and

8:53 Speaker 1: you know what the price is and you just go

8:55 Speaker 1: and you buy the tickets at the price that you're

8:57 Speaker 1: expecting them to be because that's what they're announced at,

9:00 Speaker 1: and that that is over, you know. I mean, if

9:02 Speaker 1: you're buying tickets to a smaller sh like, for example,

9:05 Speaker 1: if you're buying tickets to go see John Posse at

9:07 Speaker 1: Dart at the Rex Theater on Friday night, I don't

9:10 Speaker 1: think those prices are going to change, right, you know.

9:13 Speaker 1: But but when you're a ticketmaster, uh, and you can

9:17 Speaker 1: afford all this technology to control the prices and everything,

9:20 Speaker 1: you know, you can do whatever you want. I mean Ticketmaster,

9:22 Speaker 1: it is truly a monopoly. They can do whatever they want.

9:25 Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that they can do whatever they

9:27 Speaker 1: want without some consequences. So let's look at this again.

9:32 Speaker 1: The newest wrinkle in the what did I say?

9:37 Speaker 2: I'm calling them loll loll Gallagher.

9:41 Speaker 1: I should if you're just joining us, I should clarify

9:44 Speaker 1: it's an amalgam of NOL and Liam, because apparently I

9:47 Speaker 1: have difficulty say NOL and Liam, so it's easier to

9:49 Speaker 1: just say loll. They are almost indistinguishable in terms of

9:54 Speaker 1: I mean, they don't look exactly alike. But if you

9:56 Speaker 1: listen to an interview with them. You know what's funny

9:59 Speaker 1: about OA Back in the nineties when they first got big,

10:03 Speaker 1: that first album definitely maybe really blew up. I remember

10:07 Speaker 1: seeing interviews with them on MTV and MTV would actually

10:12 Speaker 1: they would actually subtitle the interviews. Obviously the Gallaghers were

10:16 Speaker 1: speaking English in the interviews, but their accents were such

10:20 Speaker 1: that you almost couldn't understand them, so MTV would actually

10:24 Speaker 1: subtitle the interviews.

10:25 Speaker 2: It was funny.

10:28 Speaker 1: And I don't know if they were doing it to

10:29 Speaker 1: be funny or kind of doing it to be funny,

10:32 Speaker 1: but it was funny. They can be difficult to understand.

10:35 Speaker 1: By the way, Noel Gallagher is very funny too.

10:37 Speaker 2: He's got it.

10:37 Speaker 1: I don't think Liam's particularly funny, but Noel has a

10:41 Speaker 1: very dry sense of humor that I like anyway. Okay,

10:44 Speaker 1: so here's the newest wrinkle, and this is from Music

10:50 Speaker 1: Businessworldwide dot Com. UK competition regulator launches investigation into Ticketmaster

10:57 Speaker 1: over Oasis ticket sale. So now the government's involved, says here.

11:05 Speaker 1: The UK's Competition and Markets Authority CMA has launched an

11:11 Speaker 1: investigation in the Live Nation owned ticketing giant Ticketmaster. The

11:15 Speaker 1: reason for the investigation last Saturdays on sale for Oasis'

11:19 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five UK Actually, what was the date on

11:22 Speaker 1: this article, September fifth. Okay, so it is referring to

11:25 Speaker 1: last Saturday. So it's referring to the on sale that

11:28 Speaker 1: happened one week ago for Oasis' twenty twenty five UK

11:33 Speaker 1: and Ireland stadium tour, including quote how so called dynamic

11:40 Speaker 1: pricing may have been used unquote, the CMA said in

11:43 Speaker 1: a statement on September five. The Competition watchdog says the

11:50 Speaker 1: plans to scrutinize quote excuse me, whether the sale of

11:55 Speaker 1: Oasis tickets by Ticketmaster may have breached consumer protection law unquote,

12:01 Speaker 1: because again, like I was saying, not everyone thinks that

12:05 Speaker 1: the dynamic pricing is right or ethical, And I'm not

12:10 Speaker 1: saying that I have a problem with it. I'm just saying,

12:13 Speaker 1: you know, well, apparently it's people in government who are saying,

12:17 Speaker 1: we're not sure that this is the correct way to

12:19 Speaker 1: be treating consumers.

12:21 Speaker 2: I'm not making a judgment about it.

12:23 Speaker 1: I'm agnostic on that part of it, but I think

12:26 Speaker 1: it's interesting that you know, what I do think will

12:30 Speaker 1: be really interesting is does this stick around the dynamic

12:35 Speaker 1: pricing concept in terms of tickets. It's already lasted longer

12:39 Speaker 1: than I thought. This has been going on a few

12:42 Speaker 1: years now. When it started, I remember thinking this isn't

12:45 Speaker 1: going to last. There is going to be so much

12:48 Speaker 1: backlash to this. People are not going to like it.

12:52 Speaker 1: People are used to tickets go on sale, They go

12:56 Speaker 1: on sale for a particular price. If a show isn't selling,

13:00 Speaker 1: rarely will you even see the price go down, right,

13:04 Speaker 1: You rarely see that. You very rarely see discounted tickets.

13:08 Speaker 2: In fact, you're.

13:09 Speaker 1: Look, if you're a promoter and you've got a big

13:12 Speaker 1: show in an arena, say right, and tickets aren't moving,

13:16 Speaker 1: you'll give away tickets before you'll lower the prices. That's

13:20 Speaker 1: true if you've got if you've got a show in

13:26 Speaker 1: a ten thousand seed arena. Again, this is if you're

13:28 Speaker 1: the promoter putting on the show, not the band's management

13:33 Speaker 1: has no say in this, or certainly not the record label, nobody,

13:37 Speaker 1: or even the venue. You're the promoter and you're deciding.

13:40 Speaker 1: You're making decisions based on how these tickets are moving.

13:43 Speaker 1: If it's soft, meaning you're not selling enough tickets, you're

13:47 Speaker 1: not selling as many as you thought you were. What

13:50 Speaker 1: you'll do is very often is they call it papering

13:53 Speaker 1: the room, which means because what you don't want at

13:58 Speaker 1: the end of the day is a half empty arena.

14:01 Speaker 1: So if you're in a ten thousand seat venue and

14:07 Speaker 1: you're only on track to sell five thousand tickets, you

14:12 Speaker 1: don't want that. It just doesn't look good right to

14:16 Speaker 1: have a ten thousand seat arena that's only half full.

14:19 Speaker 1: So if you were thinking you're gonna sell eight thousand, right,

14:23 Speaker 1: so you'd be at eighty percent capacity. Sorry, if I'm

14:27 Speaker 1: getting two into the weeds, but I know a lot

14:30 Speaker 1: of people in the industry listen to the show.

14:32 Speaker 2: So if you're only at you think you're gonna be.

14:35 Speaker 1: At eighty percent capacity, you're gonna sell eight thousand out

14:37 Speaker 1: of ten thousand seats, and but it's looking like you're

14:41 Speaker 1: only gonna hit five thousand. You don't want a half

14:43 Speaker 1: empty arena, So you will give away tickets to that show.

14:47 Speaker 1: It happens all the time. You'll you'll be contacting every

14:53 Speaker 1: radio station you can find that you think might be

14:55 Speaker 1: interested in doing a ticket giveaway, be giving them out

15:00 Speaker 1: to businesses and saying, here, give these to your employees,

15:05 Speaker 1: or do some kind of contest, do whatever you want

15:06 Speaker 1: with them, just make sure people.

15:07 Speaker 2: From your company show up at the show.

15:09 Speaker 1: You'll do anything that you can to get more people

15:13 Speaker 1: in the door. And at that point, it's all about

15:16 Speaker 1: the optics of it. It's all about what it looks like.

15:18 Speaker 1: Because you don't want to put on a show in

15:21 Speaker 1: a ten thousand seed arena that's literally half full and

15:26 Speaker 1: then have that, you know, have people hear about it,

15:29 Speaker 1: have people seeing on social media tickets of a half

15:31 Speaker 1: empty arena, just.

15:33 Speaker 2: All of that.

15:34 Speaker 1: You want it to look like everything that you do

15:36 Speaker 1: is successful. So you're going to paper again, it's called

15:41 Speaker 1: paper in the room. You're going to try to get

15:43 Speaker 1: as many people in there as you can, and if

15:45 Speaker 1: that means because you have nothing to lose, right, if

15:48 Speaker 1: you're not going to sell those tickets, you might as

15:51 Speaker 1: well give them away because the show's gonna happen no

15:54 Speaker 1: matter what, and you're gonna have to pay everybody.

15:56 Speaker 2: No matter what.

15:56 Speaker 1: If you're the promoter, you've got financial obligation tied up

16:00 Speaker 1: in this. You might take a loss on that show,

16:02 Speaker 1: but you might as well get as money as many

16:04 Speaker 1: people in the door as you can, so at least.

16:06 Speaker 2: It looks good.

16:07 Speaker 1: So the point being, what you'll rarely see. I can't

16:16 Speaker 1: say never, but what you'll rarely see is a promoter say, Okay,

16:21 Speaker 1: these tickets they're not moving at sixty dollars, so I

16:27 Speaker 1: think we're going to drop the price to fifty or

16:30 Speaker 1: to forty and see if we can sell some more.

16:31 Speaker 1: You just don't see that they'd rather paper the room

16:34 Speaker 1: than lower the price on the tickets. Reason being, if

16:39 Speaker 1: you lower the price on the tickets, again not using

16:42 Speaker 1: Ticketmaster's dynamic pricing, I'm just saying, if you decide, as

16:45 Speaker 1: the promoter, you're going to lower the price, now you're

16:51 Speaker 1: you're risking well, first of all, you're risking alienating the

16:55 Speaker 1: people who already bought the tickets at the higher price,

16:58 Speaker 1: So you don't want them going on so media saying

17:00 Speaker 1: hey I got ripped off. But although that's probably not

17:04 Speaker 1: that likely. But what you also don't want to happen

17:07 Speaker 1: is what if you lower the price but it doesn't

17:10 Speaker 1: it doesn't juice the sales. Now you're taking an even

17:14 Speaker 1: bigger loss. You could lower the price, but it doesn't

17:19 Speaker 1: increase your sales. The same number of people who were

17:22 Speaker 1: probably going to buy tickets end up buying the tickets

17:24 Speaker 1: anyway regardless. Right, So they would have bought the tickets

17:27 Speaker 1: anyway if they were still ten dollars more, twenty dollars more.

17:31 Speaker 1: So you lower the price, you still only sell five

17:34 Speaker 1: thousand tickets. You're you've still got a half empty room,

17:36 Speaker 1: and you've actually made less money.

17:38 Speaker 2: So it's not worth the risk.

17:40 Speaker 1: So the best thing to do, at least in my

17:44 Speaker 1: experience and from what I've seen, is in that situation,

17:47 Speaker 1: you leave the ticket price as it is and you

17:50 Speaker 1: just hope that you know, you get a lot of

17:53 Speaker 1: walk up right, you know, people coming showing up on

17:56 Speaker 1: the day of and and you try to paper the room,

18:02 Speaker 1: you try to give out some tickets too. But this

18:06 Speaker 1: dynamic pricing has changed to everything. So again getting back

18:11 Speaker 1: to this article, over ten million fans from one hundred

18:15 Speaker 1: and fifty eight countries are confirmed to have queued up

18:18 Speaker 1: on Saturday, August thirty one to buy tickets to the tour.

18:23 Speaker 1: Yeah so it was yeah, so, like I said, it

18:25 Speaker 1: was last weekend that the tickets went on sale. Two Additionally,

18:29 Speaker 1: additional Wembley Stadium shows have been added due to quote

18:34 Speaker 1: unprecedented demand during the sale, which Oasis said in a

18:39 Speaker 1: press release Saturday, quote saw all ticket platforms struggling to cope,

18:43 Speaker 1: resulting in immense frustration and disappointment for fans who missed

18:47 Speaker 1: out after queuing for many hours.

18:49 Speaker 2: Unquote. By the way, the.

18:51 Speaker 1: Same thing happened in the United States. If you remember

18:53 Speaker 1: with Taylor Swift, same thing. You know, people were frustrated.

18:58 Speaker 1: They were trying to get I remember seeing people on

19:02 Speaker 1: social media just you know, in tears over it. They

19:04 Speaker 1: were so desperately trying to get Taylor Swift tickets and

19:08 Speaker 1: uh and couldn't because you know, you wait, you log

19:12 Speaker 1: onto the website, you're in the queue, You're waiting and

19:15 Speaker 1: waiting and waiting, and then eventually something happens. You know,

19:18 Speaker 1: maybe the site crashes, or you know, there's something something

19:23 Speaker 1: goes wrong, maybe your computer suddenly wants to update and

19:27 Speaker 1: shuts itself down and restarts or whatever it is, right,

19:30 Speaker 1: you know, after you've already invested hours of your time

19:32 Speaker 1: and then you now you're you're at the back of

19:34 Speaker 1: the line, or now you log back in and the

19:36 Speaker 1: shows sold out. So you know, so this this is

19:40 Speaker 1: not in and of itself unprecedented, but to put the

19:48 Speaker 1: extent of that demand into context, Wembley, where Oasis are

19:53 Speaker 1: now set to play seven of the tours nineteen dates,

19:57 Speaker 1: has a capacity of ninety thousand, which means that the

20:01 Speaker 1: band would need to perform one hundred eleven dates at

20:04 Speaker 1: the stadium to meet the demand for next year's tour.

20:10 Speaker 1: The following Wednesday, and the same press release announcing the

20:13 Speaker 1: two additional Wembley shows, Oasis publicly distanced themselves from the

20:19 Speaker 1: decisions that led to the use of Ticketmaster's dynamic pricing

20:23 Speaker 1: tools during the sale.

20:25 Speaker 2: Yeah, so a.

20:26 Speaker 1: Lot of this went on. Where now Oasis, the Gallagher brothers, Lowell.

20:33 Speaker 2: I'm calling them.

20:34 Speaker 1: I've melded them together into one person, Lowell Gallagher. It's

20:39 Speaker 1: just easier economy of language.

20:41 Speaker 2: My friends.

20:43 Speaker 1: So now fans are pointing at them and going, you

20:48 Speaker 1: guys are bad, you guys are greedy.

20:50 Speaker 2: All this.

20:51 Speaker 1: In reality, it really doesn't have much to do with them,

20:55 Speaker 1: but they're going to take the blame. Of course, they're

20:58 Speaker 1: the public faces of this. I'm I have a hunch

21:02 Speaker 1: that they probably don't care that much because.

21:08 Speaker 2: You know, they they're extremely.

21:11 Speaker 1: Rich and famous, and you know is you know it

21:16 Speaker 1: probably doesn't affect that much. I don't think a mean

21:19 Speaker 1: comment from a fan is going to hurt the Gallagher brothers.

21:23 Speaker 1: But but that is, you know, they're they're the face

21:26 Speaker 1: of it, so it's they're going to take the brunt

21:29 Speaker 1: of the anger and ire from people. It says here,

21:34 Speaker 1: informed sources speaking to MBW, which is Music Business Worldwide,

21:39 Speaker 1: This is a great website. This week estimated that ten

21:41 Speaker 1: to fifteen percent of the one point four million tickets

21:44 Speaker 1: sold over the weekend were quote dynamically priced on ticket Master,

21:49 Speaker 1: meaning the price automatically adjusts based on supply and demand.

21:52 Speaker 1: The price for these tickets more than doubled from a

21:55 Speaker 1: face value of around one hundred and fifty pounds I

21:59 Speaker 1: assume that's pounds to an in demand price tag of

22:03 Speaker 1: around three hundred and fifty five, causing fan outcry on

22:08 Speaker 1: social media platforms and much discussion in other media outlets

22:12 Speaker 1: including MBW on Tuesday, and again, that takes us back

22:21 Speaker 1: to what I was saying before about how long will

22:23 Speaker 1: this last? People don't like the dynamic pricing, They end

22:28 Speaker 1: up feeling taken advantage of, and they end up feeling

22:31 Speaker 1: ripped off as a free market economist. I'm not an economist.

22:35 Speaker 1: I'm sorry as but as but as a I don't

22:41 Speaker 1: know why I said economist, but you know, as someone

22:43 Speaker 1: who believes in free markets, let me put it that way.

22:47 Speaker 1: I you know, I'm not I'm not really taking a

22:51 Speaker 1: position one way or the other. It's it's supplying demand,

22:54 Speaker 1: it's being applied here. It's almost like an auction in

22:57 Speaker 1: a sense. Right, but buying the tickets, I'm not taking

23:01 Speaker 1: a position. I'm gonna remain agnostic on it, at least

23:03 Speaker 1: for now. But I'm telling you this could be the

23:07 Speaker 1: nail in the coffin of this particular strategy, because people

23:13 Speaker 1: are you know, the last thing you want is your

23:17 Speaker 1: consumers or your fans to feel that they've been victimized.

23:21 Speaker 1: You know, I saw one comment somebody directed at the

23:24 Speaker 1: Gallaghers saying, you know, I wouldn't have thought. I wouldn't

23:28 Speaker 1: have thought you would be so greedy. You know, your

23:31 Speaker 1: fan base is, you know, kind of working class people,

23:35 Speaker 1: and here you are being so greedy. And again it's

23:39 Speaker 1: but it's not it's not them. I'm not saying they're

23:44 Speaker 1: not greedy. Maybe they are.

23:46 Speaker 2: I don't know.

23:47 Speaker 1: Again, you know, you get when you get to that level.

23:51 Speaker 1: I mean, there's been plenty of research and studies done

23:54 Speaker 1: on this. When you get to a certain level of

23:55 Speaker 1: fame and money, there is a certain almost as sociopathy

23:58 Speaker 1: that sets in.

23:59 Speaker 2: Right, So you know, I'm not.

24:03 Speaker 1: Saying they're not terrible people. They may be, they may

24:06 Speaker 1: not be. I don't know. I'm a fan of their music,

24:10 Speaker 1: but if I actually met them, I might be horrified.

24:13 Speaker 1: They say, don't meet your heroes.

24:15 Speaker 2: I don't know. But it's ultimately not their fault.

24:18 Speaker 1: But but if there's enough outcry over this, over this

24:22 Speaker 1: whole dynamic pricing thing, this might be the beginning of

24:26 Speaker 1: the end of it. So the band's press release said, quote,

24:32 Speaker 1: it needs to be made clear that Oasis leave decisions

24:36 Speaker 1: on ticketing and pricing.

24:37 Speaker 2: Entirely to their promoters.

24:39 Speaker 1: And management, and at no time had any awareness at

24:43 Speaker 1: dynamic pricing was going to be used.

24:46 Speaker 2: Unquote.

24:50 Speaker 1: Is that satisfactory? Probably from a pr standpoint, probably not.

24:57 Speaker 1: No one's going to believe that. No one who's no

25:00 Speaker 1: no one who's angry about this is going to read

25:02 Speaker 1: that statement and say, oh, Okay, it's really got nothing

25:07 Speaker 1: to do with them. I mean, it's true in a

25:10 Speaker 1: sense right. But there's a big hole in this though too.

25:14 Speaker 1: Let me read part of this again. It needs to

25:17 Speaker 1: be made clear that Oasis leave decisions on ticketing and

25:19 Speaker 1: pricing entirely to their promoters and management. One little problem

25:24 Speaker 1: with that. So promoters are people you're in business with, right,

25:30 Speaker 1: the promoter is the one. Well, the promoter first of all,

25:32 Speaker 1: takes all the risk. Again, I have experience in this,

25:35 Speaker 1: so I know how this feels. Not on this level obviously,

25:38 Speaker 1: but you know the promoters putting on the shows and

25:43 Speaker 1: handling all of that, so you are somewhat at a

25:47 Speaker 1: promoter's mercy. The problem is the sentence says that they

25:54 Speaker 1: leave this to their promoters and management. And management is

25:59 Speaker 1: a problem to me because that's there's a cop out there.

26:03 Speaker 1: Oh that's our management. Well, here's the thing is management

26:07 Speaker 1: works for the band. The band doesn't work for management.

26:10 Speaker 1: It's not how you know, it's not. It's not like

26:13 Speaker 1: in the corporate world, you know, when if you have

26:15 Speaker 1: a manager, you work for your manager, right, they're your boss,

26:18 Speaker 1: you know. In the music industry it's the other way around.

26:20 Speaker 1: In that if if you are an artist and you

26:24 Speaker 1: have a manager, the manager is someone you hire they

26:26 Speaker 1: work for you. You hire them to run your business,

26:31 Speaker 1: the business of your music. So for the band to say, well,

26:37 Speaker 1: that's not up to us, we leave that to our management,

26:40 Speaker 1: Well that the management works for you, dude.

26:43 Speaker 2: You know, you can't really pass the buck.

26:46 Speaker 1: You know, they're your employee in a sense, not literally

26:49 Speaker 1: an employee.

26:50 Speaker 2: They you know, they've got contracts and everything. But you

26:52 Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, you know, So.

26:54 Speaker 1: To say it's one thing to say, I you know,

26:56 Speaker 1: you can kind of let it fly a little bit

26:58 Speaker 1: and say, well, it's it's not our fault, it's you know,

27:02 Speaker 1: we leave that to the promoters. Well, yeah, that's what

27:04 Speaker 1: the promoter does, right, that's their function. But to say

27:07 Speaker 1: and management, well, that's your management is they're your management.

27:13 Speaker 1: You You can fire your management if you want to.

27:16 Speaker 1: You can tell your management don't do it this way.

27:18 Speaker 1: It's upsetting our fans. You can tell your management to

27:21 Speaker 1: handle it differently.

27:22 Speaker 2: Okay.

27:23 Speaker 1: So there's more to the statement quote. While prior meetings

27:28 Speaker 1: between promoters, ticket Master and the band's management resulted in

27:31 Speaker 1: a positive ticket sales strategy which would be a fair

27:35 Speaker 1: experience for fans, including dynamic ticketing to help keep general

27:39 Speaker 1: ticket prices down as well as reduced touting. The I

27:45 Speaker 1: don't know touting is that maybe that's a term for

27:52 Speaker 1: that almost sounds like a might be another term for scalping.

27:57 Speaker 1: In the United States, we call it scalping. Maybe there

27:59 Speaker 1: they call it touting. I don't know, Sorry, I just

28:02 Speaker 1: I don't know what that word means in that, but

28:04 Speaker 1: I assume from the context it might be another term

28:06 Speaker 1: for scalping. The execution of the plan failed to meet expectations.

28:10 Speaker 1: All parties involved did their utmost to deliver the best

28:13 Speaker 1: possible fan experience, but due to the unprecedented demand, this

28:16 Speaker 1: became impossible to achieve. M I feel like there's a

28:24 Speaker 1: contradiction here. Did anyone else here a contradiction? Yeah, there's

28:31 Speaker 1: a there's a pretty latent contradiction self contradiction in this

28:37 Speaker 1: statement that to me seems glaringly obvious. So let's back

28:46 Speaker 1: up a little bit. So the statement opens with it

28:49 Speaker 1: needs to be made clear that Oasis leave decisions on

28:51 Speaker 1: ticketing and pricing entirely to their promoters and management, and

28:54 Speaker 1: at no time had any awareness that dynamic pricing was

28:58 Speaker 1: to be used, So the band had no idea according

29:02 Speaker 1: to that paragraph or that opening statement, that opening sentence,

29:07 Speaker 1: that of the statement that dynamic pricing was to be used.

29:10 Speaker 1: But then they say, oh, okay, I'm sorry. No, I

29:17 Speaker 1: was wrong. I was wrong.

29:18 Speaker 2: I retract. There is no there is no contradiction.

29:23 Speaker 1: I thought there was a contradiction because it sounded like

29:26 Speaker 1: they're saying that Oasis had no idea, the band had

29:30 Speaker 1: no idea. And then I see this sentence while while

29:34 Speaker 1: prior meetings between promoter, Sigmaster and the band's management resulted

29:38 Speaker 1: in a positive ticket strategy, you know that everyone thought

29:40 Speaker 1: would be fair, and I thought I took that as

29:45 Speaker 1: everyone was involved in that decision. But no, that's not correct.

29:50 Speaker 1: The band the band is not mentioned in that part.

29:53 Speaker 1: So there is no contradiction. I was wrong about that.

29:55 Speaker 1: I apologize. Okay, all right, Well, so taking that into

29:59 Speaker 1: a count, it's probably the best possible statement that you know,

30:09 Speaker 1: it's the best damage control they could do. Let me

30:11 Speaker 1: put it that way. It's not going to satisfy people,

30:14 Speaker 1: but its damage control is about just doing the best

30:19 Speaker 1: you can with a rough situation. The CMA said today

30:25 Speaker 1: that and again that's the part of the government that

30:27 Speaker 1: does consumer protection in the UK that it is at

30:32 Speaker 1: the initial stage of its investigation. It will now engage

30:35 Speaker 1: with Ticketmaster and gather evidence from various other sources, which

30:39 Speaker 1: quote may include the band's management and event organizers unquote. SJM,

30:44 Speaker 1: Live Nation, MCD and DF Concerts are promoting the Oasis tour.

30:48 Speaker 1: Ticketmaster was one of the three sites used, along with

30:51 Speaker 1: Gigs and Tours and See Tickets. The CMA stressed in

30:56 Speaker 1: its statement on Thursday that quote, it should not be

30:58 Speaker 1: assumed that Ticketmaster has broken consumer protection law unquote No,

31:04 Speaker 1: I mean and from look, I'm not a legal expert

31:07 Speaker 1: of any kind, and there may be an element to

31:09 Speaker 1: this that I'm missing, but I don't see any anything

31:13 Speaker 1: that makes me say, oh, it sounds like, Look, we

31:15 Speaker 1: can talk about this whole dynamic pricing strategy as being

31:20 Speaker 1: kind of dirty business. Right again, I'm going to remain

31:24 Speaker 1: agnostic on it for now, but that doesn't mean it's

31:28 Speaker 1: and that anything's illegal about it yet. Right, There's nothing

31:34 Speaker 1: illegal about it that I can see. The Competition Regulator

31:39 Speaker 1: added that it will quote also consider whether it is

31:42 Speaker 1: appropriate to investigate the conduct of anyone else in relation

31:44 Speaker 1: to the matter.

31:45 Speaker 2: Unquote.

31:47 Speaker 1: Dynamic ticket pricing sees prices surge in real time as

31:50 Speaker 1: demand rises, similar to airline.

31:53 Speaker 2: Tickets or Uber Live.

31:55 Speaker 1: Nation has previously argued that the program addresses the issue

31:59 Speaker 1: of scalper is buying tickets at face value and then

32:01 Speaker 1: selling them at a higher price point. Wait, they have

32:11 Speaker 1: I gotta click this link they have. That's their argument

32:16 Speaker 1: that it reduces scalping. That's why they do it. Uh,

32:27 Speaker 1: I just clicked and our I just looked another article

32:30 Speaker 1: that might explain it. But well, we might come back

32:32 Speaker 1: to this later if we have time.

32:35 Speaker 2: I don't see how that would be the case. But

32:40 Speaker 2: I'm open to the argument, but.

32:42 Speaker 1: I don't see how how would that How would that

32:45 Speaker 1: prevent scalping? What am I missing? Maybe I'm missing something again.

32:49 Speaker 1: I'm trying to be fair, all right. The CMA said

32:52 Speaker 1: on Thursday, they quote this is not the first time

32:54 Speaker 1: that the use of dynamic pricing has raised concerns among

32:58 Speaker 1: fans of live sporting events and music events unquote. According

33:02 Speaker 1: to the CMA, while the practice is quote not automatically unlawful,

33:06 Speaker 1: it may breach consumer protection or competition law in certain

33:10 Speaker 1: circumstances unquote. Sarah Cardell, chief executive of the CMA, said, quote,

33:16 Speaker 1: it's important that fans are treated fairly when they buy tickets,

33:19 Speaker 1: which is why we've launched this investigation. It's clear that

33:23 Speaker 1: many people felt they had a bad experience and we're

33:25 Speaker 1: surprised by the price of their tickets at checkout. We

33:28 Speaker 1: want to hear from fans who went through the process

33:31 Speaker 1: and may have encountered issues so that we can investigate

33:33 Speaker 1: whether existing consumer protection law has been breached by the way.

33:36 Speaker 1: That's something there's more to the statement, but that's something

33:38 Speaker 1: we can all relate to. Right, you go to buy

33:40 Speaker 1: tickets and again, I you know this doesn't I don't

33:45 Speaker 1: think this really happens with smaller ticketing agencies or smaller tours.

33:50 Speaker 1: But you go to buy tickets from Live Nation and

33:54 Speaker 1: you go to check out, and the ticket price is

33:56 Speaker 1: suddenly much higher, not necessarily because of dynamic pricing.

34:00 Speaker 2: But all these all these fees.

34:03 Speaker 1: And taxes and everything, and you thought you were gonna

34:06 Speaker 1: spend one hundred dollars on a ticket, and all of

34:08 Speaker 1: a sudden it's you get to check out and it's

34:10 Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty and you're like, where did this other?

34:13 Speaker 1: I mean no, I'm not even exaggerating, Right, it'll be

34:16 Speaker 1: that much more it's it's wild and and there's like

34:20 Speaker 1: all these fees and you know, there's a yeah, there's

34:25 Speaker 1: just any any fee you can you can imagine. I

34:28 Speaker 1: don't remember too, It's been a while since I've even.

34:31 Speaker 2: Bought tickets from Ticketmaster. I don't know.

34:34 Speaker 1: Uh, I don't remember if it even itemizes it for you,

34:37 Speaker 1: doesn't Maybe if somebody's in the chat room, I should

34:40 Speaker 1: take a breath and say hello to everybody in the

34:42 Speaker 1: chat room. But does it even itemize it for you?

34:46 Speaker 1: Or does it just say taxes and fees and it's

34:48 Speaker 1: this huge additional number that you weren't expecting, or you

34:51 Speaker 1: were expecting if you buy tickets from Ticketmaster regularly. But

34:57 Speaker 1: Alex Whiteley is in the chatroom. Are one of our

34:59 Speaker 1: friends from the UK? Oh says touting is a term

35:02 Speaker 1: used for people selling tickets on for higher prices.

35:05 Speaker 3: Okay, Oh.

35:11 Speaker 1: Miriam Banish also joins us in the Facebook clatchat Yeah,

35:13 Speaker 1: thank you for that, Alex.

35:15 Speaker 2: Uh we don't use that.

35:17 Speaker 3: Term in the Uh.

35:18 Speaker 2: We we don't use touting. Uh.

35:23 Speaker 3: We have a call. It's see who we have here?

35:29 Speaker 2: Hi, welcome to Matt Conderson. Unleast, who's this?

35:33 Speaker 4: Hey?

35:34 Speaker 2: Hey, Charles Richardson, how are you?

35:37 Speaker 4: I've been better, but hanging in there?

35:40 Speaker 2: What's what? What's going on?

35:41 Speaker 1: I should, by the way, Charles, I should just tell

35:43 Speaker 1: you upfront. We only have a few minutes because we

35:45 Speaker 1: have a guest calling in UH at ten am.

35:48 Speaker 2: But what's on your mind?

35:50 Speaker 4: I want to try and make it quick. Number one

35:53 Speaker 4: take a master Live Nation. All these other they're all

35:56 Speaker 4: scam artists, uh. And the fact that they're going with

35:59 Speaker 4: this this pricing technique is really embarrassing. Listen, if I

36:05 Speaker 4: buy a seat in section one oh one, in the

36:07 Speaker 4: first ten rows, it should be one price. The next

36:10 Speaker 4: ten rows is another price. There should not be any

36:12 Speaker 4: alternative pricing. But there's scam artists because you got this

36:17 Speaker 4: ticket surcharge fee, you got this fee, that fee, the

36:20 Speaker 4: damn fees costs more than the damn tickets sometimes, so

36:24 Speaker 4: I think it's all just a really big joke.

36:26 Speaker 2: If you want my est opinion, well it is it

36:28 Speaker 2: is true. I mean you get to the uh, you

36:31 Speaker 2: get to the end of.

36:32 Speaker 1: The process, and the price is it just all of

36:36 Speaker 1: a sudden It's Yeah. Sometimes the fees they are almost

36:39 Speaker 1: as much or perhaps even more uh than the ticket itself.

36:43 Speaker 2: It's wild.

36:45 Speaker 4: It is, it is. It's embarrassing to buy tickets nowadays

36:48 Speaker 4: because everything's done online and they're just reaping the benefits

36:51 Speaker 4: the fact that they do alternate pricing for scalpers. Are

36:55 Speaker 4: you kidding me? Please? That's such a lame excuse. That's

36:59 Speaker 4: almost like the glib your honor.

37:03 Speaker 2: All right by Charles. Good here for me, my friend,

37:05 Speaker 2: take care all right.

37:06 Speaker 1: That was Charles Richardson, of course, from the Charles Richardson Show,

37:10 Speaker 1: although I think he's taking a little bit of a

37:11 Speaker 1: break from that right now.

37:12 Speaker 2: But good hear from Charles. Yeah, I mean, I'm not

37:16 Speaker 2: gonna go.

37:18 Speaker 1: I relate to his frustration, certainly, I think most of

37:21 Speaker 1: us probably do. I'm not going to go so far

37:23 Speaker 1: as to say that it's a scam, because you know,

37:27 Speaker 1: to use that word, I would say a scam would

37:31 Speaker 1: be in my mind, if you go to buy the

37:35 Speaker 1: tickets and you after you've checked out, you end up

37:39 Speaker 1: with a charge on your credit card or your debit

37:42 Speaker 1: or whatever that's higher than what you thought it.

37:44 Speaker 2: Was going to be.

37:45 Speaker 1: You do know what the final price is before you

37:50 Speaker 1: click that to pay that and make that purchase. But

37:54 Speaker 1: it is true, so I would not. I would not

37:57 Speaker 1: technically call it a scam. I would I would just

38:00 Speaker 1: with Charles on that, although I'm certainly sympathetic with the

38:03 Speaker 1: broader point that he was making. And again, and I

38:06 Speaker 1: think a lot of us can relate to that frustration,

38:08 Speaker 1: and it is interesting, like you you really and this absolutely,

38:13 Speaker 1: I don't think anyone can argue with It is definitely

38:16 Speaker 1: designed the process unless it's changed. Again, I haven't bought

38:20 Speaker 1: tickets from Ticketmaster in quite a while, so unless the

38:22 Speaker 1: process has changed, it is designed so that you don't

38:26 Speaker 1: see that final number until the very end. So you're

38:32 Speaker 1: going through the entire process of picking your seats and everything.

38:36 Speaker 1: You're going through that entire process unless you have bought

38:40 Speaker 1: tickets recently. Right If it's if you go to a

38:43 Speaker 1: lot of shows, none of this will surprise you.

38:46 Speaker 2: But if you don't go to a lot.

38:47 Speaker 1: Of shows, you're going through that entire process with one

38:49 Speaker 1: price in your mind. And then you get to that

38:53 Speaker 1: final screen and that's where it shows you all these

38:56 Speaker 1: fees and you're like, oh, this ticket just doubled in price.

39:03 Speaker 2: Let's see. Isaac Banks is also.

39:06 Speaker 1: In the chat room. Alex Whiteley says people had to

39:12 Speaker 1: sign into their Ticketmaster way to be accepted into a ballot,

39:17 Speaker 1: which took hours for some. Then some were told that

39:21 Speaker 1: they were going to have to pay upwards of four

39:23 Speaker 1: hundred pounds per ticket.

39:27 Speaker 2: Yeah.

39:29 Speaker 1: I mean again, I don't know that I would call

39:33 Speaker 1: it a scam per se, but it certainly is. I

39:40 Speaker 1: think we can all understand why, just from a consumer standpoint,

39:43 Speaker 1: you might have a pretty bad taste in your mouth

39:46 Speaker 1: after going through that, right,