CJ Wildheart | Matt Connarton Unleashed

0:00 Speaker 1: All right, what a relief crisis averted. I think let me bring this up here. I think we've got c J Wildheart with us via Microsoft Team.

0:08 Speaker 2: CJ. Are you there, I am, yes, and I can hear you, mate.

0:12 Speaker 1: Oh wonderful, wonderful. Thank you for your flexibility. We are live on the air, and I'm really glad to get John because I've been dying to talk to you, and we you know, you are here to experience a first here on Matt Connorton on Leafs and I've never had WhatsApp crash on me like that. And then apparently WhatsApp has restricted my account. They are accusing me of spam, which is very very strange. So thank you for being flexible and welcome to the show.

0:38 Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. It's probably my fault you've been banned from WhatsApp.

0:43 Speaker 1: You're going to take the blame for that. Well, that's very generous of you. Thank you.

0:47 Speaker 2: My reputation for seed it does.

0:51 Speaker 1: That's funny. Well listen, so welcome to the show. I love that song, you know, we did open with the single One of the Boys, such a great track. And but you you've been at this for a while, and of course you've got the new album Devil or how long? How is now new is Devil? At this point I should say how long has this been out? This is pretty news?

1:11 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the official release was yesterday. Oh wow.

1:18 Speaker 2: I run my online store so I do pre orders. So most people who bought it on vinyl, which is sold that now and CDs have received you know, they received their vinyl and CDs a week or so before the album officially came out. But we ran into a glitch yesterday, so it isn't up on all the usual streaming sites at the moment, so oh okay, that out. It's just up on bank camp digitally. But you know, it's it's the way of the soul trader, the entrepreneurial punk rock musician these days. You know, you get your music out there by any means possible.

1:58 Speaker 1: Exactly absolutely. And Camp by the way, you know, this comes up a lot on the show. Band Camp is such a great site because it's very artist friendly, as you know, and also too, when you get your music from band camp, you get the highest quality file that you can get. It's it's not like you know, just streaming it from YouTube or whatnot, which is fine, but band Camp really does you write, you know, in terms of the quality of the file that you're getting when you buy your music on band Camp, and of course, like I said, very artist friendly.

2:24 Speaker 1: So so that's excellent that you're you know, that you've got it up on there. Can can you talk about you know, because you you mentioned you kind of alluded to some of the challenges obviously that that can happen to an independent artist. And I was reading something about how this album nearly didn't happen because you were kind of struggling to sort of figure out how to how to navigate through the current industry and some of the challenges that come with it. Is that true?

2:54 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean a lot of it. I'll be honest with you. I mean I've been I'm fifty eight now, and i've been you know, I signed my first record deal when I was eighteen, so that's like, you know, forty years ago, and you know, I'm Generation X and I've gone through the whole change from analog to digital, and so much has changed in the music industry. But you know, my time was the nineties. That was my time when I had a huge record deals with massive corporations and if I hadn't had those big record deals, I wouldn't be talking to you today, you know, because I sell predominantly to a fan base that was started in the nineties, they eighties, And the problem with my fan base is they're getting older, a lot of them are dying off, a lot of them don't buy physical music anymore.

3:39 Speaker 2: And I make a living from selling physical music, not digital music. Cee these vinyl T shirts. And when your fan base is getting smaller, you start making less and less money, and so it gets harder each year to you know, call this a job, call it a living, but it's all I've done all my life, you know, I haven't. You know, I've never ran a day job alongside the music. Music has always been my day job. And on this album, I kind of knew how much I was going to sell, and I knew it was going to take me about six months to make I record mostly on my own, and I was thinking, why am I doing this?

4:18 Speaker 2: I would probably earn more money put in the fries in the bag.

4:22 Speaker 1: You know what I mean, understood? It is? It is challenging, and obviously, you know you've been around long enough that you've seen all of the changes in the music industry over the years. And it is true too. You know, you make money on merch and things like that and physical media, but in terms of what you're putting out digitally. You know, obviously we talked about it on the show a lot. Spotify doesn't pay very much. It's it's hard, you know, it's it's hard to make a living. A lot of people don't realize that, you know.

4:49 Speaker 1: They think that if you're a musician and you're active, that you're in a mansion and you're driving a sports car and you know, you're flying a private jet everywhere, and it's, uh, it's not how it works.

5:00 Speaker 2: I mean, I'll be really honest with you. I had to sell the mansion in the private jet. I traveled most places by hot air balloon. Now the wed role in England had to get rid of the carton as well. You know, sure, times are.

5:14 Speaker 1: Hard times, absolutely absolutely, And this is Your Devil is your eighth solo album. Is that right?

5:20 Speaker 2: It is? I mean it's my eighth studio solo studio album. I have a I put out a live album as well, and I had a best of album where I re recorded fifteen of the old tracks as well. So on my label it's album number ten, and I have two unofficial demo albums as well, so technically it's album number twelve.

5:42 Speaker 1: Oh wow, okay, okay, you've been busy now. Originally, so when when you first when you first signed your wow eighteen right, So was that with the Wildhearts when you signed your first deal?

5:56 Speaker 2: No?

5:56 Speaker 1: No.

5:56 Speaker 2: I used to have like a glam sleazy band called the Tattooed Love Boys in the eighties and it was the band that kind of got me into London and got me on the London scene. And we were signed to a subsidiary of RCA and I made an album with them. But I was gigging heavily with that band in the late eighties around you know, in the UK rock scene. And it's how me and Ginger met. I was playing a club in London and a mutual friend of ours Boredom along and you know, from that initial meeting we said, yeah, let's form a band together.

6:33 Speaker 2: And that band was a Wild Arts.

6:34 Speaker 1: Oh okay, gotcha, gotcha. So with the original deal with RCA, I mean, obviously, what was your output on that deal with the first band that you had? I mean, was that because sometimes and This is another thing that people outside the industry don't realize. Just because you signed with the label doesn't mean that the label is necessarily going to actually release your music and that you're going to you know, immediately have a lot of success and whatnot. I mean, what was that experience like with that first deal?

7:01 Speaker 2: Was it was good? I mean the album came out in the States, but we never made it over to America. And I mean, to be honest with you, from the ages of about say eleven until I was twenty, I went through various scenes very quickly. So I went from being into heavy metal to being into sleeves well to be in the fresh metal, and I was into sleeves for a couple of months, and ultimately I landed in punk. You know, punk is where I've always stayed. But it was a real learning curve those formative teenage years and just finding where I felt comfortable because I've loved I love all sorts of music, and especially guitar music, and you know, I had to go through I had to be in like a kind of glammy sleeveze band to get to the clash place where I feel most comfortable.

7:51 Speaker 1: Right now, that makes sense, do you. I mean, ideally, you've released so many albums as a solo artist. I assume that's what you're preferences at this point, like have you thought about have you thought about starting another band or joining a band? Or are you is this kind of the trajectory that you intend to stay on in terms of having a solo career.

8:12 Speaker 2: No, I mean it's purely survival. So I run my own label and everything I release as a solo artist comes out of my own own label. But you won't get it in the shop. You have to buy it from my online shop and or you buy it from a streaming site digitally that I record the albums. I do everything in house. I even you know, this week, I've sent out about a thousand albums and I've packaged them all myself.

8:36 Speaker 1: Wow.

8:37 Speaker 2: So it's like a real cottage industry, and that's how I make a living my albums. I have my own home, little studio home set up, and I record most of my albums on my own in my house, so I'm not paying for studio time. Once I've recorded these albums, I use a program drums, I go to a proper studio and work with a producer and I've used Jason Bold from Bullet from My Valentine Oh for my last albums. He's played drums on my last eight solo albums.

9:07 Speaker 1: Oh wow, okay, okay, excellent. But yeah, so you sorry? Oh no, go ahead, go ahead, CJ.

9:15 Speaker 2: So the way I survive is by doing d I Y. You know, it's doing it yourself. But if the food Fight has called me, it said come on board, CJ, you wouldn't You wouldn't be hearing many solo albums.

9:29 Speaker 1: Right, that makes sense? Did uh? Did you always kind of have it in the back of your mind that that you were going to do this d I Y as as you are today because you mentioned it's kind of it's survival. But there's also something I would think very satisfying, right about having the level of control that you have over everything that you're doing, by having your own label and by doing this all yourself. I would imagine there's there's a certain gratification that comes with that. Or maybe not. Maybe some days, maybe sometimes you have days where you go, I really could use some help here.

10:06 Speaker 2: I feel so freed. The way I work, there's no one telling me what to do, have the sound, how to look it's like going shopping in the mood. You know, I can let whatever I want hang out when wherever I want to, whenever I want to, And that is really it's an amazing feeling having that much control over everything you do. But you know it comes at a cost, because yeah, I don't have a big record deal. I don't have a distribution network all over the world. I have a deal in Japan still, which is I'm really grateful for, you know, and this album has actually come out properly in Japan.

10:45 Speaker 2: You can get it in shops and but as far as the rest of the world is concerned, if you don't come to my store, you won't know who I am. You know, it'd be really hard to track me down, right, And so you know it's I am what's known as a real underground musician.

11:02 Speaker 1: You know, I'm a mold right right. Well, but you're doing it, You're making it work, and that's that's more than a lot of people can can manage to pull off. But obviously all your experience and everything and the you know, the legacy that you've built is helpful with that. And that which kind of leads me to a question about the song one of the Boys. It feels like it's it's really kind of about looking back and and can you can you tell? I love that song? And we did open with that. That was our our opening track as far as the segment goes, can you tell us about that song?

11:30 Speaker 1: And I don't know if I'm reading Sometimes I wonder if I'm reading too much into lyrics, and they really don't mean as much as whatever my brain tries to assign in terms of lyrics. But it feels like it's about looking back, looking back on success and mistakes and and all of it. Am I am I on the right track with that?

11:49 Speaker 2: It's it's the song is when I started this album, started the writing process because it wasn't. It was really hard for me to just get going because because of you know, ultimately, when you're a musician, you want you want you want some level of success. And when you know before you've written a note how many albums you're going to sell, and that it's going to be a struggle, it's hard to find the motivation. So One of the Boys was written from the perspective of an older musician coming to the end of his career, maybe saying goodbye yeah and then just looking back and saying like, you know, it doesn't matter what you've done, what mistakes you've made, you know how many big shows, small shows, how many tours you've done.

12:29 Speaker 2: When you look at yourself, you're just one of the boys, one of the lads. You know, you're no more no lets you know, your ego, the size of your car or how small your car is, our bigger houses, how smaller houses. It doesn't matter, right you stripped that way. You're just blood, guts and.

12:46 Speaker 1: Bones, right right. Absolutely, So I'm curious about this. Is this true that you're you're nineteen eighty nine Gibson BB King Lucille guitar is featured in the Punk exhibition at the Gibson in London? Is that true? It was?

13:03 Speaker 2: Yeah, So Gibson contacted me and said, we're celebrating fifty years of punk and we really want to have like Lucy my guitar and there, and I was like really, you know, and I was like really flattered, and yeah, the guitar is so well known and people know you CEJ from the Wildhearts and all your other bands and know you know, you're a lot of your solo stuff is very very punk and it's going to be up there with Captain Sensible's guitar. And then they said Mick Jones and I was like, yeah, you can take her, take her, do whatever you want with her.

13:36 Speaker 2: And she was down in London for about a month and it was at the Gibson Garage down in Oxford Street and a lot of people saw it, and Gibson gave me an update and they said a lot of people made a beeline to her because she's such a unique looking, you know, Gibson guitar and they just said, you know, it's such a cool guitar, and yeah, I was really honored. My guitar is actually better known than me, which is brilliant.

14:04 Speaker 1: That's that is wild. Oh that that is so cool. That is so cool. Uh So what's kind of your forward trajectory? And maybe you don't know yet? Obviously the the album literally just came out right devil? So do you know where you're going after that? Do you plan to make another solo album? And part of why I ask, is it almost I think you had said somewhere I read that you you refer to this album as a possible swan song, but which I find hard to believe. It sounds to me like you've got a lot more music in you.

14:35 Speaker 1: But but do you know what's next for you after this album?

14:38 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've started the follow up already. Oh good, good one isn't a fun song anymore. The follow up is called Chalk and I've started compiling the ideas and the songs for that. My artist has already done the cover for it. And yeah, so it's literally I'm not touring in the UK. I've got a Japanese tour in April. I'm looking for some support tours for next year for the UK, But for the rest of the summer and the rest of the fall, I'm heads down working on the next album.

15:12 Speaker 1: Gotcha, Gotcha very good? And is there a theme with the album? You know, we talked about the song one of the Boys, but the album Devil, I mean, is there a theme throughout the album or is it just And I did listen to the whole thing, so I didn't necessarily detect anything specific, But I'm curious from your perspective, and it's great, by the way, but I'm curious from your perspective, is there is there kind of a theme or a unifying message to the album.

15:38 Speaker 2: I mean all my albums, I write about what's going on in my life. And a lot of reviewers have picked up on the kind of there's almost like a tinge of bitterness, and there's a lot of retrospective sort of soul searching going on in this album. And they're quite right, and the bitterness is it's not bitterness, it's more frustration. Yeah, you know, forty odd years of making music, and I see myself here. Although I am in a good place emotionally and spiritually, financially it's a struggle, you know.

16:11 Speaker 2: I'm like a lot of people on this planet, struggling financially. But this album, it covers a lot. There's a lot more songs on here looking back. There's a song called SOB called Sad Old Boy, and that's me looking back at the eighties and the nineties. There's also a lot of frustration with the world at the moment. Nine ninety nine is about what's going on in this country at the moment, and it's a song called No More, which is all about the wars and life, crime and stuff was going around the world.

16:39 Speaker 2: I have a very young son, athough I'm almost sixty. My son turns twelve in August, and my constant worry is about the world he is going to inherit when he's a young adult, and I just hope it's better than the planet we're living on right now.

16:57 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's also something very relatable. I think. I think a lot of people, especially from our generation. I'm also a Gen xer, and I think a lot of our generation kind of feels that way. You know, we're we we we blame the boomers for for a lot of what we were left with, and then we worry about what I don't have any kids myself, but we worry about what the what, what the generation that that is after us is gonna deal with, and what kind of a world we're leaving for them, and and uh, you know, and that that cycle continues.

17:24 Speaker 1: But I think that's relatable. I think a lot of people feel that way so and that that might be someone of some of what really connected with me about the album. Like I said, I listened to the whole thing. I think it's great. Where does the title come from? Why did you decide to call it devil?

17:39 Speaker 2: A couple of things. I knew it was going to be like a devil of an album to make and I also have a Hot Source brand called Devil's Fit, So the artwork of the album is taken from the artwork of my Hot Source brand. So the devilhead is the logo for my my Hot Source. So it's kind of all connected. Yeah, I've had my own Hot Souce brand for about twelve years now and it's based on my mum. I've made Hot Sauce, So everything's connected. I can't I can't sing about anything or do anything that will connected to my life.

18:18 Speaker 2: It has to. I mean, there's a song on Devil called Fade right at the End, which is about my mum and dad, who both succumbed to dementia of Alzheimer's. I had to watch them fade in front of my eyes very slowly over many years, and you know, it was a really hard song to write and sing, but I needed to do something. I needed to immortalize the feeling of love and hate and guilt I felt watching both my parents slowly die in front of my eyes, and to put it into music is a really, really good way of just exercising those feelings and kind of letting them out of you.

18:53 Speaker 2: And that's what I use a lot of my music to do, especially feelings of anger and frustration. I use my songs to let those feelings out. I think it's better I put it into art, into something like that, rather than drinking them away or you know, snorting them away or fighting them away. My way of exercising the beast, the demon is through through my music. So that's why a lot of the subjects on my albums can sometimes be a little bit heavy. But if I write a love song, you know it's going to be about you know, my wife or my child.

19:23 Speaker 1: Now I'm glad to hear you say that too, because that's the subject that comes up a lot on the show. Is how you know, music is such great therapy. And if you anytime that you can take trauma or stress or things that you're worried about, whether it's something that's happened to you or something that you're worried about happening, or whatever it is, whatever's bothering you or in your case, you know, you talked about fate and what that song means witches. You know, I can only imagine what it's like to go through that.

19:49 Speaker 1: But anytime you can take something that's negative and turn it into art, then you're taking something negative and making something positive from it. And not only is that great therapy for you as the person who is creating that art, but it also might help other people who then can enjoy that art and connect with it, and maybe it helps them with what they're going through as well. So I think I think music is the best, the best therapy that you can whether it's making it or listening to it, it's it's really is the best therapy in my opinion, So and creating I agree.

20:24 Speaker 2: I agree with you, yeah, one hundred percent. There's most people are the same. It doesn't matter how you wrapped up. You know, the plumber and the same as adopted. Adopted is the same as the rock star, the rock stars, the same as the mechanic. We're all the same underneath. And it doesn't matter what what standing you have in life. You could be the billionaire, a millionaire, a plumb on the street, or you just could be a normal, everyday working class dude or woman. And we're all connected by the same stories.

20:53 Speaker 2: We all breathe the same air, people die around us, we can all fall in love, we can all lose something, win something. And if you sing about stuff that is actually happening in your life. There's a good chance that it's happening in billions of other people's lives, so there's always that connection there. So I always sing about or write songs about things that have happened to me. And I always have a lot of people come back at me, not millions, but you know enough saying that they're connected to the song because it happened to them and they understand where I'm coming from, And you know, for me, that's a really important thing.

21:29 Speaker 2: I won't sing about dragons and wizards and things I know nothing about. There's not been wrong with that, but I don't deal in fantasy. I deal in reality.

21:37 Speaker 1: Right right one, absolutely well, CJ. Wildheart, this has been wonderful. It's great to have you on the show. We'll definitely do this again in the future, especially as you're going to be releasing new music. And I do want to again thank you for you know, thank you for your flexibility in terms of what platform we use to bring you on. Technology will fail us at times. Go ahead, definitely.

21:59 Speaker 2: Can I just say this, I said it with Devil It's my last album. This next one I'm making could potentially be my last album. When you say it's your last album, people tend to buy more copies of them. So it's a really good strategy to sell more else.

22:14 Speaker 1: That is true. And it works with touring too, if you say you're going on a farewell tour, you know, and then it works. It works for a lot of It's worked for a lot of artists. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, So we will end our conversation with another track from the album Devil. But I not to put you on the spot, but we already we played a bunch of them while I was trying to get the situation worked out with WhatsApp and and all that. So I would like you to pick what should we what should we play from the album to end the segment.

22:44 Speaker 1: It's just the only stipulation being because we're on terrestrial radio in the United States, can't have any swears in it.

22:50 Speaker 2: But the art of being free, Okay, that's what I love the decades.

22:58 Speaker 1: Oh excellent, all right, very good, So we'll we'll end with that, so again CJ Wildheart. Oh one other thing, where's the best place for people to go online to keep up with everything that you're doing and to buy the album?

23:09 Speaker 2: Yeah, so if you go to uh, it's CJ Devil Spit all one word, CJ Devil Spit.

23:18 Speaker 1: Okay, okay, I've been to the site, by the way, it's excellent, so I really like that. I'm a website nerd.

23:23 Speaker 2: So the album. A lot of my albums are sold out now, so it's a good and it's a good place to be selling out.

23:32 Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely all right, my friend c J Wildheart will let you go. We will hit that track, but we will do it again in the future. And thank you so much for joining us today. This has been wonderful.

23:43 Speaker 2: Really appreciate it. Matt, all right, you take.

23:45 Speaker 1: Care, all right, you two take care, bye bye, all right. That is CJ Wildheart. The new album with very new just came out, Devil, and let's play this track. And again I did listen to the whole thing. It's great. I suggest you check it out. Devil by CJ Wildheart. And this is called the Art of being Free.