Richard McMahon of Bring Your Own Hammer | Matt Connarton Unleashed

0:00 Speaker 1: Richard McMahon. He is with us via Restream. Hello, Richard.

0:04 Speaker 2: Hi, Matt. How are you doing? Good, good.

0:06 Speaker 1: I'm glad to have you on. I've really been looking forward to this. And, you know, we have had a couple of artists on who are involved in the Bring Your Own Hammer project, who have recorded things for it. So it's really interesting. And, you know, if I understand your role in the project correctly, you kind of find fragments of people's lives in historical records. And then the musicians who are involved in the project turn those fragments into songs and The project sort of explores 19th century Ireland and includes people whose lives are in some cases only briefly documented.

0:45 Speaker 1: And your role is, I mean, is historian, is that the correct way to kind of label, if I may, what it is that you do in the project?

0:56 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's a fair description of my primary role, at least. I mean, I suppose the project originated when I was actually sitting in the city archives in New York, gosh, maybe 15 years ago. And I was looking at the case that Old Oak Road is based upon. I came across it in the crime records, the district attorney indictment papers for New York. And it was this statement made by a woman describing arriving into New York. She was heavily pregnant. And then later it was discovered there was a dead body in the room she was staying in.

1:28 Speaker 2: And it was the body of an infant. And the way she told the story and her sense of disorientation, I was immediately grabbed by it. But I was also struck that if I put that into my normal historical work, you'd probably get lost, get lost in a page, a sentence or two, maybe a footnote in an article. And I thought that was doing a disservice to the richness of the way she told the story and the kind of sadness of the heart of the story. So I had this idea, well, what if someone else was to take this source and create something from it, an artistic, response to the source and really put her story front and center.

2:06 Speaker 2: And that was the initial spark, I suppose. And since then, I've been sort of collecting lots of these kind of different archival materials relating to different aspects of Irish history, Irish American history, and encouraging artists to create new material from it.

2:20 Speaker 1: How do you kind of figure out, I mean, is it something that you know instinctively when you come across one of these stories or one of these people who, you know, again, you know so little about them, but other than something very interesting happened to them. But, I mean, do you know right away, oh, this might make an interesting song? Or do you have to kind of sit with it for a while to come to that conclusion? Or how do you figure out what to pass on to the artists?

2:47 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a great, great question. I mean, in some ways, the less we know about someone, the better, because it opens up the space then to have a creative response. If we knew more about them, maybe I'd make it into an academic article or make it part of a book. But the fact that we know so little about the characters often helps sort of develop a kind of imaginative response to the source. So it can be a little bit hit and miss. You know, at the start, I would share an awful lot of material with the artists.

3:19 Speaker 2: Sometimes, you know, 3,000 pages of a document and say, you know, just go in and explore it. And actually, we got great material from that as well. But more and more, I've been kind of tailoring it, I think, picking out particular sources that I think might suit particular artists.

3:33 Speaker 1: So how did this all begin? How did Bring Your Own Hammer, did you say 15 years ago was when you started this project?

3:40 Speaker 2: Well, I first had the idea for it in the early 2010s, definitely, when I was working in New York. And then it took a little while. Initially, I reached out to Cahill Coughlin, who's a fantastic Irish singer-songwriter. Unfortunately, he died in 2022. But through the late 2010s, we worked quite closely together to try and develop a project. And the more we worked on it together, the idea initially was that he would record an album based on a variety of different sources. But the more we worked on it, the more realized we needed to bring other people in.

4:15 Speaker 2: So we had this idea, well, why don't we expand it and invite other artists into the project? And we really didn't know what we were doing at the start, which was good. You know, we had to kind of learn and develop it as we went along and, you know, try and figure out how will this work? And it really it was actually an artist called Eileen Gogan, who was the first person to produce something for the project. And she produced this quite extraordinary kind of eight minute song working with another artist on the project, Mike Small.

4:45 Speaker 2: And a really kind of striking piece. And I think that really gave a shot in the arm to the project because other artists heard it and they kind of responded and they could see how she had done it. And that really got the ball rolling. So it was trial and error. And it took a while for us to all feel comfortable, including myself, about what we were doing. And I suppose I tried to make the artists feel comfortable so that they didn't feel they were being judged, that there wasn't a kind of professor waiting around the corner to tell them they got it wrong or something like that.

5:16 Speaker 2: I wanted them to feel they could be as creative as possible with it and just see where it brings them. And I've really tried to stick to that. You know, occasionally we might say, well, I'm not sure if that fits historically, but very, very rarely. I mean, most of the time the artists really respond to it in a really respectful way, but really imaginative way. So, you know, it took us a while to get going. And then it was, I suppose, 2022 when we released the first songs from the project. And I suppose that marks the kind of beginning of the public face, if you like, of the project.

5:48 Speaker 1: Gotcha. Do you ever run into a situation where maybe, you know, you have a story that you think would be, well, this would make a great song, but then for whatever reason, maybe whoever, you know, the artists who get involved in it, maybe it just doesn't work out and you have to kind of you know, walk away from that one?

6:08 Speaker 2: Yes, that happened. So I got very early in the process. I would get a little sort of feeling, oh, it's a real shame that no one is working with that particular source. I go, you know, there's real potential for that to be a really nice song, you know. And Old Oak Road is actually an example of that. So actually what I started doing with, I have to say, considerable reluctance was sketching out lyrics myself. and sort of creating a kind of lyrical template that the artist could then respond to. So Old Oak Road is an example, that first song you played, of a song where I wrote the lyric, Mike Small then set it to music, and then Cahill, Coughlin, and Ja Wobble came on board to play on it as well.

6:48 Speaker 2: So it was a kind of genuine collaborative effort. But it came, I suppose, initially from my fear that that initial spark that had come from the project, from that source, wouldn't be used by someone. So I kind of said, I ended up stepping into the breach myself to kind of fill the gap. But sometimes a brilliant source doesn't always spark off a song, but a lot of the time it does. If the source is really strong and there's a great story to it, I'm usually fairly confident that someone will respond well to it.

7:21 Speaker 1: Sure, sure. So tell me about the process of when you've got the source, you've got the. The idea you've got the story and the person it's about, do you then, do you then go to a specific artist who's involved in the project or, or has done something in the project already and presented to them specifically? Do you sort of, or do you, do you put it sort of out there to several different people who are involved or do you try to pull in somebody new to the project or what's kind of the process there?

7:50 Speaker 1: Or maybe it, maybe it changes depending on the story.

7:52 Speaker 3: I don't know.

7:55 Speaker 2: It's changed over time. So at the start, I would upload an awful lot of material onto a kind of Dropbox. And people could go in and have a look around and see if it suited them. And that was, I think, in principle, that's great. I think that's a really interesting way to work. But I think people, you know, they could go in and they could have a look, but maybe they weren't sure what exactly they would sort of go with or what would fit. So increasingly, I've tailored it. I've said, oh, that source would really suit me.

8:24 Speaker 2: this artist. I think, you know, there are a couple of artists I've worked very closely with on the project. So Michael Small, Mike Small and Michael J. Sheehy. And sometimes I come across a source and I kind of know that in their hands it will be, it will work. You know, I have a sense that it would suit them and they're great. You know, they've, you know, decades of experience in writing songs as well. So I have a lot of trust in them. And they're also very good at coming back to me and saying, actually, this doesn't work or it doesn't suit me or I've tried it and it doesn't work.

8:56 Speaker 2: So there's that degree of trust and that we won't be, nobody's going to be offended if it doesn't work out. And if it works out, it's fantastic, you know.

9:05 Speaker 1: Yeah, we had Adrian Crowley on the show, and he was describing how you would send him stories that might inspire songs. And is he one of the artists whom you've worked with a lot? I kind of got that impression through my conversation with him that he might be kind of one of the go-to artists to work with in terms of these songs and these stories.

9:29 Speaker 2: Absolutely. Adrian's been a mainstay of the project. a wonderful kind of contributor to the project. He initially came in on the recommendation of Cahill Coughlin, who was, as I say, there at the very start of the project, and he brought Adrian on board. And Adrian is, I think, distinctive in his approach in that he will take a source and he'll work something incredible out of it. But he's actually one of the composers on the project who does his own kind of historical research as well so you'll find that he's headed off and he's found something that he's particularly interested in or he'll ask me you know Richard do you have anything on shipwrecks and I'll go okay I better go around and find what I can find out about shipwrecks so he's actually very proactive in you know, taking on board what we have to offer, but also digging out his own material.

10:19 Speaker 2: So, I mean, he's been, he's been fantastic for the project. I mean, he wrote, I think one of the cornerstone songs of the project, which is a song called golden streets, bitter tears, which I'd advise people to check out because it's just a wonderful Irish American story at the heart of that song, you know?

10:36 Speaker 3: Yeah.

10:36 Speaker 1: That was one of the ones that we played actually when we had him on.

10:38 Speaker 4: Yeah.

10:40 Speaker 1: My grief on the sea was the first album for the project, correct?

10:45 Speaker 2: That's right.

10:46 Speaker 4: Yeah.

10:46 Speaker 1: Okay. And then it's, you know, about sea journeys and migration, uh, from, uh, you know, about leaving Ireland and some of the, the tragedies there as the title, my grief on the sea, uh, would imply what, why, why was that the, the kind of the starting point for the project or was it even intended to be the original starting point?

11:05 Speaker 2: It, it wasn't supposed to be, um, it was supposed to be low on order, which is the album we're bringing out this year. Um, but it just developed organically.

11:13 Speaker 3: Yeah.

11:14 Speaker 2: Yeah. So this is, Part of the reason why the new album is a double album is that we've been building it up for quite a while. But that first album, just the songs all came together and gelled very nicely as a collection of songs about the sea. And we were very struck that Irish historians actually, even though Ireland is surrounded by the sea, the sea is central to Irish history, actually historians hadn't written that much about it. So from a historian's point of view, it was really kind of fascinating.

11:40 Speaker 2: And we liked the idea of looking at the sea as something that offered you something, a promise. It held out the promise of something better. And yet it also held out the peril, I suppose, of the migrant journey, the tragedy of it. So there was that lovely kind of dual aspect to the sea, the kind of promise of the sea and the peril of the sea. And then the fact that the sea doesn't care one way or the other, I also thought was quite nice, you know, quite a striking kind of dimension to trying to understand Irish history, 19th century Irish history.

12:13 Speaker 2: the kind of just the difficulty of it, but then the sense of endurance that people had as they took that sea journey across the Atlantic.

12:20 Speaker 1: Yeah.

12:21 Speaker 3: Yeah.

12:22 Speaker 1: Um, I know the, the, the things that we played on the show when I, you know, talked with Adrian really, uh, really kind of, uh, just amazing. I mean, it's, it's a lot of these songs, I describe them as haunting, you know, and, and, um, I was very, very impressed, um, with what I was hearing. I really kind of, puts you into the moment. I'm not even sure quite how to describe it the right way, which I guess in a way is a good thing because it shows that the music really moved me in a way that's hard to even put into words.

12:55 Speaker 1: I'm also curious, when you bring a story... uh, to, to these artists, are you ever surprised at, at what comes back? Is it ever something that's very different than what you had in mind, or maybe it even sort of not changes the story, but, but maybe what they come up with kind of, um, maybe affects the interpretation of the story, at least that, that you had in mind for it. Are you ever surprised?

13:26 Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. I mean, it's always a grace kind of moment when I get to hear, the finished song and hear how it's developed. I mean, I guess the title track from the new album is a very good example. It's called From the Tombs, and it's a kind of continuation of the story from Old Oak Road, which you played at the beginning. And Old Oak Road is, as you say, very haunting. I think fits the source extremely well. It kind of captures that story, the sea journey. But for this song, the kind of sequel song, continuing the story when she's in prison, the writer, Mike Small, took a really different approach, which really kind of took me aback because he wrote a pop song, really.

14:07 Speaker 2: And it's kind of, for me, it was sort of, oh, that's really, really interesting. It never occurred to me to write a pop song about a woman in prison in New York in 1882. But I thought it worked really well. I mean, and there's a great collection of people on there like Bernard Butler from Suede and Fergal Alder from the Cranberries and June Miles Kingston from the Communards and Marcus Holdaway from the High Llamas. So they all bring this different textures and different dimensions to the song. It was, for me, just wonderful to see it all coming together and what a brilliant job Mike did of pulling these different strands together and making me think about how we present these stories.

14:49 Speaker 2: You know, it would never, ever have occurred to me to do it like that. And so from a kind of historian's point of view, you're like, oh, yeah, you can do that and it can work. And you can tell these stories in different ways and Ways that maybe, you know, in theory seem jarring or out of sync with the source, but actually work really well. So, yeah, from that point of view, it's been amazing to see how people work with material.

15:13 Speaker 1: Absolutely. Yeah, we are going to play that one as well at the end of our conversation. We'll play that one too, From the Tombs, which is really good. And then the, so it's a double album and it comes out November 13th, if my notes are correct. And so this is, so Bring Your Own Hammer, it's something that obviously there's endless, there's an endless source of material for this. I assume that this is a project that's just going to keep rolling on and will keep releasing more music into the future?

15:45 Speaker 2: Yeah, I hope so. I mean, the double album, we might have to take a little break after a double album. It seems a little... a little ambitious and adventurous to have a double album as your second album. I don't think that happens. That doesn't happen very often. Right. So we might take a little, as they say in Irish, sospyog after that, a short break. But yeah, there are other projects in the pipeline already. So there's quite a famous chief of police, a guy called Chief O'Neill in Chicago, and he collects an awful lot of Irish language material And when he left Ireland, he wrote an account of his life at sea as a young man.

16:25 Speaker 2: So I think we're going to return to that idea of the sea and Captain O'Neill, because he has these incredible adventures. He gets shipwrecked off the coast of Hawaii, and he describes taking the ship's monkey, which they picked up in Indonesia, and, uh, strapping it to his back and swimming to the shore with the monkey on his back. So, uh, if we can't make a song, if we can't make a song out of that one, I think we'll, we'll, we'll retire. But I think, I think there's just wonderful material out there.

16:52 Speaker 2: They're incredible stories, you know, that we want to, that we want to bring to life and let, you know, let people hear about them and know about them and, and feel something from them as well in a way that they mightn't do with a written history or a kind of, uh, a conventional history. So, uh, yeah. Uh, yeah, we'll do our best to keep going. I think would be the, would be the response to that one.

17:14 Speaker 1: Oh, fantastic. By the way, I haven't asked you the obvious question yet. Where does the name come from? Bring your own hammer.

17:22 Speaker 2: So that's in some ways I wish I knew because the, the, the name comes from Kyle Cox and he wrote to me when we were starting the project and he had a list of different names, I think potentially for an album. Um, And I wish I still had the email, which I don't have because I moved jobs. And anyway, it's a long story. But that was top of the list. And so he came up with the name. And I never, strangely enough, I never asked him why. I thought it was a great name. And I think it kind of means, you know, the Irish Margaret experience.

18:00 Speaker 2: You know, you're on your own. Bring your own hammer. Get to work. You know, it's going to be tough out there. I think that's where it comes from. But actually, I never checked with them. So there's a nice mystery to it, I suppose, at least.

18:12 Speaker 1: There is, yeah. Your theory, though, makes a lot of sense. That makes total sense. Very good. Well, Richard, I really appreciate you joining us today. I've been really looking forward to talking with you. I find the project, the whole thing is just really quite fascinating. And like I said, in a moment, we'll play From the Tombs and, of course, the double album coming out November 13th. So right around the corner, as we say, where's the best place for people to go online to keep up with the project, Bring Your Own Hammer?

18:44 Speaker 2: You can visit www.byohammer.com or you can check out our Bandcamp page where you can download the material, you can order the vinyl CD, and that's through Dimple Discs, which is the record label that puts the albums out.

19:00 Speaker 1: Absolutely. And what about people who just want to follow you, Richard McMahon, for people who want to keep up with what you're doing? Or maybe someone who even wants to reach out, maybe they're interested in getting involved in the project in some way or have a story that you should know about.

19:16 Speaker 2: Absolutely. So I'm a historian based at Mary Immaculate College in Limerick. And so if you look up the webpage there, you can find my email address, which is richard.mcmahon at mic.ul.ie. So drop me a line. Yeah, I'm always interested to hear from people with interesting sources and stories or song ideas. So feel free to run them by me. Or if you just have any kind of questions about Irish history or some other history to do with the project, I'm very happy to answer any questions that come through.

19:49 Speaker 1: Oh, fantastic. Richard McMahon, thank you so much. We're going to play that track, uh, from the tombs. Uh, so we will let you go, but, uh, we'll, I'm sure we'll do this again in the future. You know, obviously, um, as you indicated, this project is going to keep rolling on. And, and again, you've got the double album coming November 13th. So we will, uh, we will certainly have you, uh, back again, but I really appreciate you joining us today. And, uh, Keep up the great work. Like I said, it's really, it's one of the most interesting, you know, I interview a lot of musicians on the show, but this is one of the most interesting projects I've ever had the pleasure of getting to discuss with someone.

20:21 Speaker 1: So I really appreciate you joining us today.

20:25 Speaker 2: That's wonderful, Matt.

20:26 Speaker 1: Thank you.

20:27 Speaker 2: It's lovely to hear. And it's nice, it's nice particularly to hear from the American side. There's such an American dimension to the project. So it's really nice to get the opportunity to talk to people based in America and get their feelings and responses to the record. So thanks a million for the, for the interest and for the support.

20:43 Speaker 1: Oh, you are very welcome.

20:44 Speaker 5: All right.

20:44 Speaker 1: We'll let you go. We'll talk again soon. Richard McMahon. Thank you so much. All right. Richard leaves us and we're going to play this track now that he, he discussed from the tombs. And again, the album, the double album comes out November 13th, but let's give this a spin.

21:21 Speaker 6: From the tombs.

21:22 Speaker 5: On Elm Street The light begins its daily retreat In the.

21:35 Speaker 6: Bars poised from the piers With the girls From the markets On Leonard Street She can't.

21:47 Speaker 3: Sleep A breath heavy Among the noise of the city On Leonard Street She can't sleep On Leonard Street She can't sleep On Leonard Street She can't sleep.

21:52 Speaker 6: On Leonard Street She can't sleep.

22:17 Speaker 3: We were girls of light Out for Blackwell's Island No sun, no moon, no scars here In a cell she recalls the ship The rising swell in ocean's deep A passenger from there to here A servant sickly and.

23:06 Speaker 6: Queer A passenger from there to here, a servant.

23:22 Speaker 3: Sickly and queer. A passenger from there to.

23:24 Speaker 6: Here, a servant sickly and queer. A winged girl from Ireland, bound for Blackwell's Island.

23:47 Speaker 3: Wayward girl from Ireland Bound for Blackwell's.

24:04 Speaker 6: Island She is tired and it is dark The warden says.

24:10 Speaker 3: It won't be long A short walk to the prison car

24:24 Speaker 3: .

24:26 Speaker 6: .

24:27 Speaker 2: .

24:33 Speaker 3: .

24:33 Speaker 6: .

24:35 Speaker 3: We were girls of mine Bound for Blackwell's Island We were girls of mine Bound for Blackwell's.

24:58 Speaker 1: Island There it is from the tombs. The project is Bring Your Own Hammer. And thank you again to Richard McMahon for joining us this morning. All the way from Ireland. I am of Irish descent, by the way. That's why I have such a big head. I got this big Irish melon on. I look like a South Park character. That's what I always say. Irish people have big heads. I can say that because I'm Irish. But anyway, I don't know why I'm telling you that. But thank you again to Richard McMahon for joining us this morning.

25:54 Speaker 1: I was really looking forward to speaking with him, too, because the project is so interesting, and we have had a couple of the great artists who are involved in the Bring Your Own Hammer project. His explanation, too, of where the name came from totally makes sense to me. So I think his theory is correct. And he wasn't entirely sure because the person who had come up with the name, unfortunately, passed away, apparently. I did not realize that. in 2022. But I really like it. I encourage you to check it out.

26:24 Speaker 1: And it is on Bandcamp. If you just search Bring Your Own Hammer on Bandcamp, you will find it. But we go on. Welcome, everybody. Of course, this is Matt Connerton Unleashed, and we are live from the studios of WMNH 95.3 FM in glorious Manchester, New Hampshire. And you can stream the show from anywhere or almost anywhere. It might not be available in, I don't know, North Korea or something, but... If you go to mattconnertonunleashed.com, you can find all of your social media links, contact info, show archives, etc., etc. There is a searchable archive, too, on the website.

26:59 Speaker 1: So if you are looking for a specific episode or guest, you can find it that way. You can find an even deeper archive at my regular, my regular, my general website, mattconnerton.com. But please check out mattconnertonunleashed.com. I think you'll be glad that you did. And we have a call. Let's see who's online here. Hi, welcome to Matt Connerton Unleashed. Who's this? Hello? Are you the Phantom? The Phantom. The Phantom called. That used to happen a lot when we were on in the afternoons. I think the Phantom might have been our most frequent caller.

27:40 Speaker 2: Yeah.

27:43 Speaker 1: Anyway, live radio, what are you going to do, right? Of course, I do want to remind you, by the way, Matt Connerton Unleashed is sponsored by Matt Connerton Hypnosis. I think I know that guy. So if you are interested, if you're curious in learning more about hypnosis, you can go to my website, mattconnerton.com. You can even schedule a free consultation. I'll tell you all about it. Let's see. All right. The Phantom is calling again. Let's see if we.

28:07 Speaker 4: Hey, finally got through. How are you doing, Matt?

28:10 Speaker 6: Good.

28:11 Speaker 1: Who is this?

28:12 Speaker 3: Ronnie.

28:13 Speaker 2: Oh, Ron. Oh, my goodness.

28:14 Speaker 1: How are you, my friend? How are you? I haven't seen you in so long, for obvious reasons.

28:17 Speaker 4: Yeah.

28:18 Speaker 1: How are you doing?

28:18 Speaker 4: Oh, I know. I'm doing good. Good to hear your voice. But I have to say, that guy's got a real mellow sound, something I could listen to.

28:26 Speaker 1: Oh, do you like that? Did you like that song?

28:29 Speaker 3: I did.

28:29 Speaker 1: I did.

28:30 Speaker 4: I was like, I wish I could have heard it more than once so I could have followed the words. But I just like the sound and... No, I don't know. The instruments, the voice, it was good.

28:39 Speaker 1: I might play it again later in the show, you know, because it is a three-hour show, so sometimes, you know, we repeat things later, and of course, you know, it breaks up into one-hour blocks for the weekday replays. So I might play it again later, but I'm glad you liked it. It's interesting, too, because Richard McMahon was talking about how it's such a tragic story, but then the artists involved in the song, they took a tragic story and kind of made a pop song out of it, and it's fun. I don't know.

29:06 Speaker 4: Well, anyways, it's good to hear your voice. I'm just chillaxing, and have a good day. Good weekend.

29:10 Speaker 3: All right.

29:11 Speaker 1: Thanks, Ron. Good to hear from you, my friend. Take care.

29:13 Speaker 2: Bye-bye.

29:14 Speaker 1: Bye-bye. All right, Ron. Well, that was a nice surprise. Haven't gotten to talk to Ron in a long time. Let's see. I also do want to remind you, too, before we go any further in the show, about our amazing sponsor, Xtrilly, a great rideshare company originating right here in Manchester, New Hampshire. But they are recruiting riders, of course. So if you would like to be an Xtrilly passenger, perhaps you're tired of your current rideshare companies that you've been using. We won't mention any names.

29:45 Speaker 1: You know the big two. But maybe you'd like to try something new and hopefully better. You can try Xtrilly. If you go to the website, sign up at Xtrilly.com slash ride 953. Just like I always spell Connerton for you, I will also spell Xtrilly. It is X-T-R-I-L-L-I. So if you go to X-T-R-I-L-L-I dot com slash ride 953, you can sign up, you can get the app, be a passenger, try it out. I think you'll be very happy. And, of course, every ride share company needs drivers. So if you'd like to drive, make some money.

30:20 Speaker 1: They are pretty generous with their payouts. If you go to Xtrilly.com slash drive... You can sign up to drive. I will spell Xtrilly for you one more time. X-C-R-I-L-L-I dot com slash drive 953. Sign up today. And again, thank you to Xtrilly for supporting the show and for being one of our many great sponsors here at WMNH 95.3 FM. So we appreciate them tremendously. I am going to play, and I'm sort of calling an audible here. We hadn't... Oh, I just got a message. Oh, you know what? Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and play this.

30:59 Speaker 1: Our next guest has arrived. I'm going to go ahead and play this song because we referred to it in my conversation with Richard McMahon. from Bring Your Own Hammer. This song, we had featured this on the show before. It's called Golden Streets Bitter Tears from Adrian Crowley, featuring Bridget Maypower. This is also really good, but it's from that same project. So if you're curious to hear more about Bring Your Own Hammer, and again, all of the music is available on Bandcamp, and you can even get it on vinyl.

31:26 Speaker 1: But check this out. We'll give this a spin, and then we'll see where we go from there. But Golden Streets Bitter Tears, Adrian Crowley featuring Bridget Maypower. This is really good.